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Author Topic: Progress report?  (Read 7619 times)

great_duke

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Progress report?
« on: June 09, 2007, 09:05:17 PM »
I notice Hellequin hasn't been online since april and there haven't been news related to the mod for quite a long time...still being worked on?

Hope so... such a promising project. And I commited myself to collaborate to it eventually.

great_duke

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2007, 10:05:23 AM »
Not even a 3rd party reply? comments?  :o

I see why this seems to be dead then...what a shame  ???

bryce

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2007, 10:34:47 AM »
He might just be taking a break or have had something happen.... If he does give it up, I wonder if source is available anywhere. Maybe I will pick it up some day.

Galdred

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2007, 05:28:17 PM »
I hope you don't give up. It was one of the most promising mod, and it really "felt" like the original game :o
« Last Edit: June 17, 2007, 09:57:33 PM by Galdred »

Offline peder.moller

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2007, 02:20:25 PM »
NOOOOOO!!!

Please, oh PLEASE say it ain't so!
 :'(
I'm a big fan of both Darklands and M&B, and merging the two is a truly brilliant idea!

I've played the mod for a few hours and already it's my favorite - in spite of trying only a few aspects and in spite of the mode being in version 0.1 :)

I really, really, REALLY hope that Hellequin is just taking a break, and hasn't shelved this project indefinitely!

I'm anxiously awaiting his return  :shock:

Galdred

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2007, 07:29:36 PM »
It is this mod that made me play Darklands, and not the other way around.  ;)


Albino

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2007, 06:55:32 PM »
Well Hellequins back. Couldn't post in the other thread.

bryce

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2007, 12:18:36 PM »
Well, I said from the start moving here is a bad idea. Not many people will make a second login just to see some mods in development.

Without encouragement, mods tend to just wither and die....

I am looking forward to checking out the source, though.

Offline Hellequin

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2007, 09:39:43 AM »
As the pilot said to the copilot while the plane was upside down and pointed down at thirty degrees from the ground... "I don't like that attitude."

Bryce, capitalizing on the misfortunes of others, without having any real information about what may have been happening in the background or what other factors were involved, in order to state an infantile "I told you so", is immature, inaccurate, and rude.

I expect the story would have been identical had we not moved.  There was no lack of user encouragement, nor indeed a substantial change in its inflow from before to after the move; these forums produced good high-level discussion of some of the technical issues and helped get the mod as far as it did.  That discussion might, or might not, have been more feasible in the other environment; I have no data, and thus am not going to argue the issue one way or the other - unless I must, as now, correct someone's unfounded assertion.

'Bye, bryce.  The pattern of your assertions is a much greater reason for me to want to simply drop the whole thing, than any choice of forum; this was true before the move and remains true through the above post.  So if you want this mod to ever succeed, here's your best contribution - shut the fuck up.

bryce

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #9 on: July 06, 2007, 10:35:46 AM »
As the pilot said to the copilot while the plane was upside down and pointed down at thirty degrees from the ground... "I don't like that attitude."

Bryce, capitalizing on the misfortunes of others, without having any real information about what may have been happening in the background or what other factors were involved, in order to state an infantile "I told you so", is immature, inaccurate, and rude.

I expect the story would have been identical had we not moved.  There was no lack of user encouragement, nor indeed a substantial change in its inflow from before to after the move; these forums produced good high-level discussion of some of the technical issues and helped get the mod as far as it did.  That discussion might, or might not, have been more feasible in the other environment; I have no data, and thus am not going to argue the issue one way or the other - unless I must, as now, correct someone's unfounded assertion.

'Bye, bryce.  The pattern of your assertions is a much greater reason for me to want to simply drop the whole thing, than any choice of forum; this was true before the move and remains true through the above post.  So if you want this mod to ever succeed, here's your best contribution - shut the fuck up.

There is no reason to be so childish. I have been nothing if not supportive. I gave you my entire LOM source to work with before the project even began, which of course you immediately put out on a public server without my permission.

I'm sorry, but I seriously think you owe me an apology.

You also claim no end of support, but then you just claimed lack of help is the reason you are quitting. Seems pretty ridiculous to me. The fact remains that you are more or less quitting and I am continuing on, and so are most of the people who stayed on the other forums.

As for whether the project lives or dies or whether you put it out there, I don't really care much. I faded away early on because I did not like some of the choices you were making, both with priorities and the skills system, in addition to having my own modding goals. I am sure from my M&B experience there is nothing in it that would be too useful to my mod without so much tweaking as to make it something not worth the effort, as well.




Offline Hellequin

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2007, 11:46:43 AM »
The server was not public, and as soon as you clarified that by "you" you had meant me specifically, rather than addressing the dev team (all three of us) in the plural, it was removed instantly.  I thanked you for your code, looked through it, and found nothing I valued whatsoever.  I was polite and simply thanked you and left it at that.  Much the same as the reason you don't expect to make much use of anything I make available; that's fine.

You perceive a contradiction between my statement that I was finding a lack of help (meaning active contributions), but was not finding a lack of encouragement (meaning verbal support).  Obviously that's just a miscommunication somewhere.  Hopefully this statement clarifies it for you.  For reference, the ratio has been much better here - more of those who spoke out also contributed - than over at Taleworlds.  But that's a reasonably predictable result of the demographics.

I won't apologize for criticizing your opportunistic use of my announcement to make a childish statement.  "I told you so" is never appropriate discourse, especially when it's inserted somewhere out of appropriate context.  That was the core of your post; that was my criticism.

My tone may have been - and remains, I suspect - argumentative.  You do rub me the wrong way; sorry.  I don't think we can have a productive discussion and am not interested in a flamewar over either your original rudeness or my intemperate reply.  Feel free to have the last word, if you feel you need it, then I'm locking this thread.

bryce

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2007, 12:02:50 PM »
The server was not public, and as soon as you clarified that by "you" you had meant me specifically, rather than addressing the dev team (all three of us) in the plural, it was removed instantly.  I thanked you for your code, looked through it, and found nothing I valued whatsoever.  I was polite and simply thanked you and left it at that.  Much the same as the reason you don't expect to make much use of anything I make available; that's fine.

You perceive a contradiction between my statement that I was finding a lack of help (meaning active contributions), but was not finding a lack of encouragement (meaning verbal support).  Obviously that's just a miscommunication somewhere.  Hopefully this statement clarifies it for you.  For reference, the ratio has been much better here - more of those who spoke out also contributed - than over at Taleworlds.  But that's a reasonably predictable result of the demographics.

I won't apologize for criticizing your opportunistic use of my announcement to make a childish statement.  "I told you so" is never appropriate discourse, especially when it's inserted somewhere out of appropriate context.  That was the core of your post; that was my criticism.

My tone may have been - and remains, I suspect - argumentative.  You do rub me the wrong way; sorry.  I don't think we can have a productive discussion and am not interested in a flamewar over either your original rudeness or my intemperate reply.  Feel free to have the last word, if you feel you need it, then I'm locking this thread.

You are the only one being childish. I was hoping you might move back to taleworlds and start modding again if you got some more help and encouragement and that was the only purpose of my post, but instead you continue to insult me. Sorry, I find it pretty suspicious that a lot of the things I worked hard on you had working instantly, and to be honest that is the biggest reason I wanted to look at the source code sicne you later said I did nothing to help you - though I think a lot of it is that .808 is simply much easier to work with when doing such things. I also find it highly doubtful you found nothing of value as you IMMEDIATELY started to post code fragments with the same names as methods I had created for LOM.

It was ridiculous and stupid of you to just give out my code to 10 people, especially when no one but yourself or fisheye had any business that required the source code. There is a huge difference between giving out the source for one project and giving it to any person who shows up and says they want to be on the team and then never does any work.

I believe you are not a malicious person, but given the countless experiences I have personally had with code theft and several cases with M&B modding alone I did not want to see someone using it as a starting point without permission after I put so much work into it, but would have been more than happy for you to use that as a starting point for this mod, though it had not been converted to .808 yet which I later learned made massive changes to the way that menus work and doubled the number of operations available.

Sorry if I 'rub you the wrong way', but really I have been NOTHING but helpful and supportive, only to later get slapped in the face for it. Thanks for that. Thanks for also (incorrectly) implying that I was glad you failed so I could take your code. I did not expect to use any of it, but was more curious in general, and of course for the reasons I outlined already - with the fact you have since gone so strange about things and no longer intend to make it public making me go from a niggling suspicion to a larger one. I guess as much as it pains me, it's better simply not to trust people or do anything to help them if it can have negative consequences.

« Last Edit: July 06, 2007, 12:23:03 PM by bryce »

great_duke

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2007, 12:38:53 PM »
Pipe down both of ya. Quite the unnecessary argument...

No need to be offended by bryce's suggestion Hellequin, The lack of traffic here is a fact, as is also a fact that most mods coming here died or entered a comatose(most devs admitting lack of traffic and support as the cause). Is MBX a bad place? no, in many ways it's better than taleworlds. It is however, quite the deserted place in comparison...

You also don't have to accuse bryce of wanting to suck up your source code. If you remember correctly we made a deal in wich I would help you out with some models/textures and you would give me the explosives code.However I lost interest (and contact) after I test played the mod and saw how it worked (no possible death , funky particles ). My offer in helping out eventually still stands if you or anyone else picks this up again. Not that I don't mind your recent attitude... yet I still think a darklands total conversion for m&b is a must.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2007, 12:45:52 PM by great_duke »

bryce

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2007, 01:24:26 PM »
I wouldn't use anything of his at this point for all the denarii in calradia, no matter how much time it saved me. If you want to donate to his mod anyhow, go ahead, but it looks pretty dead to me.

Offline Hellequin

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Re: Progress report?
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2007, 07:34:49 PM »
???

I still intend to make it public.  That hasn't changed a whit.  Not a word I said even hints otherwise.

Similarly, I never did make any suggestion that Bryce intended to suck, or indeed use, anything from it - I was concurring with his experience that in general it still proves faster to reinvent something than to port it from another mod.

And when I do make it public you're welcome to verify just how entirely false your snide insinuations are.  I began to release good code quickly because 0.8x had some effective methods in it, because I obsessed about coding for it and put in long days, and because I'm a clever fellow.  If there's even a shadow of a resemblance to LOM code in there, not only is it a coincidence, it's coincident with regards to pieces of LOM I apparently didn't even see - because I can positively assert there's no there, there, with regards to anything I did even look at.

Yeesh.  Nobody stole, wanted to steal, or cared about stealing your code.  Feel free to confirm that for your paranoid self.  If you've had poor experiences with that in the past, I'm sorry to hear that... but given your tirade about "increasing suspicions" I have to wonder what the other side of that story was.

Dammit, I had meant to lock this, and not feed the troll.  Everyone else (Duke and otherwise)... no hard feelings toward the community, the project, the mod scene, or anyone specific other than this nitwit.