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Author Topic: (old) TLD Help needed: Models and Voices  (Read 529655 times)

Offline Conners

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #630 on: April 18, 2010, 05:48:44 am »
I sent the stuff to DaBlade. Ghash agh Burzum, For the Eye!, We are the Fighting Uruk-Hai, Uruk Snarl, Death, Death to Men, Tark, and Tark-glob were all sent. Not sure if any or some of these will be accepted, just mentioning in case someone was about to do orc voices. DaBlade or I will tell you if any or none were accepted, I'd say.

DaBlade

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #631 on: April 18, 2010, 09:53:03 am »
Conners will be making some cool voices for TLD :green: Orcs and Uruks should be pretty well covered after this, together with what we already had before.

I'll need to update the first post (regarding voices) soon, but I'm too busy with RL work at the moment. I'll do that as soon as possible.

Offline Merlkir

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #632 on: April 18, 2010, 10:47:08 am »
Hm! Say, Conners, are you a native english speaker?

(we could still use Harad and Easterling voices, but there's a ton of very difficult pronunciation.)
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Offline Conners

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #633 on: April 19, 2010, 02:43:11 am »
Thanks DaBlade :).


@Melkir: It's my best language, certainly. I have a talent with certain accents, typically ones I invent for characters. Depending on the speech patterns and accent you want, I might be of much help with one of the other factions. If it's not too much trouble, having an audio/video example would be very helpful.

Offline Merlkir

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #634 on: April 19, 2010, 06:39:41 am »
It's not much about accents as it's about pronunciation very different to english. It's hard for any native speaker to even read the text properly, let alone act it. I'll try to dig out the post with the pronunciation guide.
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Offline Conners

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #635 on: April 19, 2010, 07:04:33 am »
Pronunciation would also be very helpful, thank you.

Tautalos

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #636 on: April 19, 2010, 07:39:42 am »
You guys want British accents?

Offline Merlkir

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #637 on: April 19, 2010, 07:47:24 am »
Tautalos: right now I'd love to have a Persian or Arab person, but we take who we get. ;)

Conners:  Here you go. Take a look, maybe try the orders (as they're quite short). Experiment, see if you can do the phonetics. The long sentences are undoable for most people at the moment, I may find a way to shorten them so they're easier to pronounce with more punch.

This is an old project I've been working on for our MiddleEarth RPG session, but never finished it. It might be of some use ;)

Harad languages:

Harondor: - near Harad would use a modern version of the Harad language. The ancient grammar is simplified and old words are mixed with many words from Quenya (Numenorean influence) and words from the languages of Khand.
Great Harad: - people from Great Harad use a much more archaic version of the language with more complicated grammar and they don't use words from Quenya at all.
Far Harad: - primitive language very loosely related to the great Harad language. Lacks complex abstract terms and has a great amount of adjectives. 

The pronunciation is very different to english. "o" is similar as in "not", "a" as in "ah", "e" as in "let", "i" as ee or in "lip", "u" is similar to "oo" as in "ooze" or "loop". "R" is sharp and strong like a russian "r", "k" is always pronounced as Tolkien's elven "c". (so it's similar to english k, but sharper and clearer. as in "look" maybe.)
á,ú,é,í,ó - long versions of the vowels described before. "š" is "sh" as in "shoe". "j" is not english j (as in "jew", "juice" etc.), but like "i" or "y" in "yew". "h" is usually silent or half-silent. "ch" is not english as in "chemical", but like a russian or hebrew "ch". (can't describe better :/ sorry)

Harad words  -  boghi - god
                         náru - snake
                         bádag - dragon/serpent
                         vurka - wolf
                         šér - lion
                         varu - tiger
                         haraš - eagle
                         inkaba - oliphaunt
                         mereko - bird
                         mereko a kerešhvar- carrion bird
                         adhvaró - eat
                         hvaretha - food
                         sámach - black/dark
                         sukrá - red
                         uverja - chosen
                         y(j)ala - guard
                         karimnala - acolyte/priest
                         aniur - religious
                         parkui - pure
                         daluki - long
                         áfar - fire
                         šejmir - sword/ weapon
                         uštem - arrow/ dart
                         aka - bow
                         nevi - no/none
                         adum - I
                         admue - I am
                         odmue - you are
                         vadmechí - we are
                         udmue - he/she/it is
                         udmechí - they are
                         av - for
                         am - this/that
                         pukia - son
                         bastiš - soldier
                         parúv - much
                         veši - many
                         váka - mace
                         aspa - horse
                         áruja - spear
                         árubira/áruštka - spearman
                         aspabira - horseman
                         vákabira - mace/rod bearer
                         heiná - enemy (pl)
                         tuchma - brave
                         (t)apupaniya - archer
                         otí - and
                         vejša - great/mighty
                         vejdiša - greatest
                         áthasa - stone
                         ákeufasiya - mountain dwellers (dwarves?)
                         hamerúm - battle 
                         ámauta - noble
                         chaki - from
                         mányata - household/bloodline
                         tiumáta - family
                         chauva - hat/helmet
                         chšaka - empire
                         abí - to, towards
                         išuba - battle axe
                         biganu - destroy
                         jál - attack
                         verjál - Attack!
                         achuvá - fear
                         frannátar - commander
                         jíhva - alive
                         mártva - dead
                         márja - to die
                         majál - to kill
                         virmajál - to wipe out
                         jaltir - crusher/ striker
                         namauvi - angry/ vengeful
                         frajál - cut off
                         núntha - to flee
                         idú - here
                         jatánus - sorcerer
                         súrach - evil
                         chnuta - to please
                         játa - until
                         daranaja - gold
                         thaba - to burn     
                         Vidarma - the Ripper       
                         spáthanija - army camp   
                         skuthi - weak
                         kraftha - draw (weapons)
                         kareme - head     
                         frabaró - bring 

Battle Orders:
Hold position!      - Dárava ašnaí!
Charge!              - Verjál!
Hold formation!   - Gaithastúná!
Follow me!          - Sekuru adum!
Break formation!  - Biganstúná!
Mount horses!     - Aspi biram!
Dismount horses! - Aspi nibiram! 
Advance!            - Faraí!


I'll be adding useful words from Quenya and also phrases we can use for battlecries and maybe even conversations ingame. And names for items (unique weapons?)

"Odmue hvaretha av mereki-a-kerešhvar!"  - "You will feed the birds!"  (You are - food - for - birds - eating corpses)
"Odum vermajál otí verthaba av daranaja-e-jatánus!" - "Kill and burn for sorcerer's gold!"  (You - kill - and - burn - for - gold - of sorcerer)
"Odum vermajál otí verthaba av boghi-a-sámach!"  - "Kill and burn for the dark god!"    (You - kill - and - burn - for - god - dark)
"Odum verfrajál karemi-a-heiná!"  -  "Cut off heads of the enemies!"         (You - cut off - heads - of enemies)
"Odum vebiganu heiná-e-skuthi!"  -  "Destroy the weak enemies!"            (You - destroy - enemy - weak)
"Pukiai a náru-a-sámach!"   -  "Sons of the black snake!"                          (Sons - of - snake - black)
"Av Mányata a bádag-a-vejša!"  -  "For the house of the Mighty Serpent!"  (For - household - of - dragon - mighty)
"Abí hamerúm!"  -  "To battle!"  (Towards - battle)
"Frajál-a-karemi uchnute adum!"  -  "I love cutting heads!"                        (Cutting off - of heads - pleases - I)
"Apupaniya-e-ámauva ochnute adum!"  -  "I like you, noble archer!" ;)        (Archer - noble - you please - I)
"Odum frebaró aspi av ami bastiši-a-tuchma!"  -  "Bring horses for these brave soldiers!"   (You - bring - horses - for - these - soldiers - brave)
"Achuvá-e-nevi!"  -  "Fear not!"    (Fear - none)

and yeah, I'm aware it's long and a native english speaker is probably going to entangle his tongue on this :D
For better punch the pronoun bits like Odum can be left out or silenced, the same with -a- it serves as a word joiner. So karemi-a-heiná is pronounced as karemi(a)heiná.

possible items (shortened derived forms to the right): 
  • Chauva-e-bádag - Dragon Helmet   - Chaubadag
  • Išuba-e-sámach - Black Battleaxe   - Išubasach
  • Áruja-e-sukrá - Red Spear   - Ársukrá
  • Šejmir-a-jaltál - Sword of Crushing   - Šejmirtál
  • Váka-e-achuva - Mace of Fear   - Váchuva

sample of Harad writing:  (sorry, it's not exactly calligraphy, I don't have a tablet here)


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Offline Bloid

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #638 on: April 19, 2010, 12:35:13 pm »
Wow, the mod even has its own new Harad languages? Impressive, and just the sort of thing Tolkien would probably have kept doing if he hadn't died.

There's only one possibly canonical Harad-langugage word and that's Inkâ-nus(h) or Incánus, a name for Gandalf that means "North-spy". I say "possibly" since Tolkien also considered making it Quenya for "Mind-leader".

The Khand-language gets three canonical words - Khand itself, Variag and mûmak. (Variag is a variant of Varangian but I'm talking in-universe).
« Last Edit: April 19, 2010, 12:38:35 pm by Bloid »

Offline Merlkir

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #639 on: April 19, 2010, 12:46:51 pm »
Yep, those I am aware of. ;) I must really try to put together some Variag language bits.
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Offline Bloid

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #640 on: April 19, 2010, 01:11:24 pm »
Not meaning to lecture, but just pointing out the vast difference, of course.  8)

Offline Conners

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #641 on: April 19, 2010, 06:42:57 pm »
In an amount of ways, it'd be easier to have a pronunciation-version of the word next to it :o. Can do that myself before saying words, of course--as long as I don't misread. Generally, the pronunciation doesn't seem too hard so far. Only thing I'm not certain of is the sharp "R" you mention. Think I have it, though, so I'll try it out and send you a sentence or two, when I get back from work (unless I get to feel too sick).

You want me to do the words listed on the original post, or some of the ones in that quote, just wondering (I assume the former)? Will also have to do those orc voices--put it off for the sake of my voice-box.


EDIT: Got back, was feeling pretty sick, so I mightn't get to do it right now, sorry :(! I'll try if the opportunity arises. I'll just try my hand at the pronunciation in written form, to see ahead of time how well I understand.

o = o ((not "oh")) as in "not" or "yacht".

a = ah

e = e ((not "ee")) as in "let" or "met".

i = ee. OR i as in "lip"??

u = oo

I recall some Russian, now, so I think I know the type of R you mean.

k = sharp c, got it.

"á,ú,é,í,ó - long versions of the vowels described before. "š" is "sh" as in "shoe"." Might take some practice to get it how you want it, but I should manage.

Like Jehova. y or i.

h silent or half-silent.

Sort of a "tyah" almost? Might need the audio examples for that. Either way, I'll need something for the accent and speech patterns, to get them correct. The movies seemed to do it well, but the Haradrim didn't have a lot of lines.



"Odum vebiganu heiná-e-skuthi!"  -  "Destroy the weak enemies!"   (You - destroy - enemy - weak)
"o-doom   ve-bee-gah-noo   he-ee-naah - e - scoo-t~h~ee"

Something like that, I'd guess. That's also pretty confusing, though xD. Let's try saying it... I can get the words, but putting them together into the sentence properly will be difficult. I can probably say each word individually then edit them together, for the meantime (if it works that way).

For now, though, need to concentrate on orcs, and work on this on the side. Let's try some more.


"Abí hamerúm!"  -  "To battle!"  (Towards - battle)
ah-beee   hah-me-Rooom
Like that?


"Odum vermajál otí verthaba av daranaja-e-jatánus!" - "Kill and burn for sorcerer's gold!"  (You - kill - and - burn - for - gold - of sorcerer)
o-doom   ve-R-mah-jaahl   o-teee   ve-R-t~h~ah-bah   ahv   dah-Rahn-ah-jah - e - jah-taahn-oos

I can get the words relatively well, with practice, assuming I haven't messed up the pronunciation versions. Want these recorded, when I can get around to it?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 09:05:52 am by Conners »

Offline Merlkir

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #642 on: April 20, 2010, 09:14:08 am »
The pronunciation you transcribed seems correct. Feel free to leave out the pronouns like odum/admue..etc. It should make the sentences shorter and more appropriate for battlecries. Also, if it's still too long, simple two-words or single words will do. We can live with the Haradrim going around shouting "Red snake!!!!" or "For the sorcerrer!!" instead of long sentences ;P

The best thing is, even if you don't get it as I imagine it, it'll be ok, because the Haradrim are from many tribes and some of the more distant ones would definitely pronounce differently.

Considering the "R" - it's this sort of eastern R, not curled with tongue in the back like English has, but played on the teeth. The difference is well shown in the movies - Frodo pronounces Sauron and Mordor with the English R, Saruman and Gandalf (being the wizards they are) pronounce them correctly with the proper R.

edit: if you can, listen to some Japanese in Samurai movies shouting stuff. Japanese (similarly to my Harad language) has many words and it takes many words to express something (often). So a simple challenge or a battle cry will be a rather long sentence - the Japanese have a way of machine-gun firing the words you may find useful. OR use Persian (ton of clips on Youtube) and use some of their intonation.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 09:17:37 am by Merlkir »
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Aranvardo

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #643 on: April 20, 2010, 10:16:13 am »
guys, a detail, the pronunciation of many words in the tolkien's languages are identical in Spanish, i'm saying so you can, have some ground to search...
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 10:46:02 am by Aranvardo »

DaBlade

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Re: TLD Help needed: Models and Voices
« Reply #644 on: April 20, 2010, 10:33:24 am »
Just try to keep them as short as possible; short ones work a lot better in game.